[Potsy]

Another update.
Anyone fitting the SS calipers to an original Twin Cam AE82 beware, the standard brake hoses are TOO SHORT.
You could bend the tab that is welded to the strut and it might be OK, but to be safe, you really should get new hoses made up about 2cms longer in the section going from the strut to the caliper.
This isnt mentioned anywhere on this FAQ, so just incase, i thought i would mention this to save some angst.
Apart from this, i am very happy with my upgrade.
The front end feels much more "Secure and Soild" under hard braking.

This post has been edited by Potsy: 27 July 2008 - 09:24 PM

[tolisspi]

Do u can get some pics?
Is it easy to fit rear brakes on AE82?

[Potsy]

tolisspi, on Aug 19 2008, 05:27 AM, said:

Do u can get some pics?
Is it easy to fit rear brakes on AE82?

Yes i took plenty of PICs i will try to post them here shortly.
Rear brakes are now posing somewhat of a challenge. AE101 rear discs dont want to go where AE82 rear discs once were.
Has anyone had success converting AE82 Twinky rear discs to AE101 Rear discs?
My biggest hurdle seems to be the mounting of the AE101 Caliper as the AE82 has a separate plate to which the original calipers mount whereas the AE101 has the mounting lugs as part of the casting.
Maybe i need AE92 parts to complete this conversion.
Any ideas.....anyone?

[Potsy]

OK, got the AE92 SX rear stub axles, and they look like they will fit onto the 2 control arms with a bit of metal shaved off the rear most bushing.
However, the bolt spacing where the stub axle mounts to the shock absorber is now 75mm whereas the AE82 is 65mm.
Looks like i will also need the AE92 shocks......aaarrrrhg!
Anyone know if the 3 bolt holes at the top of the shock are the same between AE82 and AE92, and are the lengths of both the same or very similar under extension/compression?

[Potsy]

tolisspi, on Aug 19 2008, 05:27 AM, said:

Do u can get some pics?

Yep here are the ones from the front end conversion:

http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0043.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0059.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0124.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0127.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0129.jpg

And here are some from the currently incomplete rear AE101 conversion.
Still need the AE92 struts, so i will probably get brand new KYB's and start again.

http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0032.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0028.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0027.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0030.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0031.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0036.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0039.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0038.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0037.jpg
http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0034.jpg

As you can see the rear end is a little more difficult as you require more parts from the AE92 than anticipated.
Hopefully this will be back together before the supersprint on the 19th October.

Anyway, this is the whole car in question:

http://img.photobuck...y1/DSCF0033.jpg

[GeeEss]

Hi. . .

(Trying to) do a Superstrut Brake upgrade on early 4AGE AE92 (238mm Rotors)

1. Having some trouble sourcing Late SX / GTI Disk backing plates to use with Superstrut rotors - have sourced AE111 Calipers / Rotors / Plates tho. . . can you use AE111 Backing Plates, or are bolt locations different to AE92?

2. In brake upgrade guide, someone mentioned use of rotor DBA 743 - this rotor is only 255 diameter, even less than late SX / GTI. Can someone clarify why you can't use Late SX / GTI rotors @ 258mm diameter? Why is this disk (with all the extra hassle it entails) used instead of late SX/GTI? Are the hub diameters different?, does the inner edge of the pads rub against the disk hub? If so, why can't you just relieve some material from the pad with a grinder the same was you relieve material from 2-pot calipers to fit AE92 HUB?

GeeEss

[Potsy]

1. Having some trouble sourcing Late SX / GTI Disk backing plates to use with Superstrut rotors - have sourced AE111 Calipers / Rotors / Plates tho. . . can you use AE111 Backing Plates, or are bolt locations different to AE92?

You dont need the backing plates from the AE111, just bend the AE92 original ones back to clear the new disc.

2. In brake upgrade guide, someone mentioned use of rotor DBA 743 - this rotor is only 255 diameter, even less than late SX / GTI. Can someone clarify why you can't use Late SX / GTI rotors @ 258mm diameter? Why is this disk (with all the extra hassle it entails) used instead of late SX/GTI? Are the hub diameters different?, does the inner edge of the pads rub against the disk hub? If so, why can't you just relieve some material from the pad with a grinder the same was you relieve material from 2-pot calipers to fit AE92 HUB?

If you have the disc and caliper from the AE111 superstrut, it should be about 270ish mm diametre. Machine it down to 262ish and bung it on.
You cant/dont use the SX or GTI one because its too thin for the SS caliper and wouldnt fit anyway.
You relieve the casting from the caliper purely so it will clear the factory hub. If you were to make up some adaptor plates, you could in theory use the SS caliper as per standard and use the AE111 SS discs without machining them down to size.
I dont know how these would clear 15inch wheels though.

[GeeEss]

Potsy, on Oct 8 2008, 09:03 PM, said:

1. Having some trouble sourcing Late SX / GTI Disk backing plates to use with Superstrut rotors - have sourced AE111 Calipers / Rotors / Plates tho. . . can you use AE111 Backing Plates, or are bolt locations different to AE92?

You dont need the backing plates from the AE111, just bend the AE92 original ones back to clear the new disc.

2. In brake upgrade guide, someone mentioned use of rotor DBA 743 - this rotor is only 255 diameter, even less than late SX / GTI. Can someone clarify why you can't use Late SX / GTI rotors @ 258mm diameter? Why is this disk (with all the extra hassle it entails) used instead of late SX/GTI? Are the hub diameters different?, does the inner edge of the pads rub against the disk hub? If so, why can't you just relieve some material from the pad with a grinder the same was you relieve material from 2-pot calipers to fit AE92 HUB?

If you have the disc and caliper from the AE111 superstrut, it should be about 270ish mm diametre. Machine it down to 262ish and bung it on.
You cant/dont use the SX or GTI one because its too thin for the SS caliper and wouldnt fit anyway.
You relieve the casting from the caliper purely so it will clear the factory hub. If you were to make up some adaptor plates, you could in theory use the SS caliper as per standard and use the AE111 SS discs without machining them down to size.
I dont know how these would clear 15inch wheels though.

Thanks Potsy,

Re: wheels please review my post re: rear strut dimensions - any help would be much appreciated

GeeEss

[GeeEss]

Potsy, on Jun 14 2008, 08:47 PM, said:

Just for everyone's reference there is a difference in the disc's between an AE101 Superstrut front end and an AE111 front disc.
Unfortunately the bore centre is 55mm for an AE111, and 54mm for an AE101 superstrut.
I have learnt this the hard way. Basically i will be buying either new DBA-743's and machining and drilling to suit 4 x 100, or making a 54 ID locating ring and pressing it into my AE111 discs.
DONT GET CAUGHT OUT...like me, especially if the OEM discs are in good nic.
Cheers

Hi Potsy,

Re this post; I knocked back 2 AE111 rotors today because I couldn't be assed with extra expense of getting centre sleeve machined PLUS machining OD. I told the guy I was going to try & track down AE101 BZT rotors (did I do wrong? I'm starting to think so...).
According to ToyoDIY.com the part numbers for disks on AE101 BZT / AE111 BZR are the same >> 43512 12390. ?????

Regards

GeeEss

[Potsy]

Just completed the AE101 rear disc and caliper swap into my 1986 AE82 Twinky.
It does work, but it is a fair bit of mucking around with many parts sourced from an AE92/3 just so the AE101 stuff fits.
This is what you need to get:

1. AE101 Discs, calipers and hub (bearing carrier) and backing plates
2. AE92/3 disc braked stub axle (cast iron bit)
3. AE92/3 shock assembly's (both sides)
4. Possibly an AE92/3 front-most lower control arm (To be confirmed by others) otherwise do as i did and modify your AE82 one.

OK, now the fun starts......
Remove all the existing AE82 rear suspension, leaving only the rear most lower control arm and the front swingarm attached to vehicle.
Remove the entire shock absorber from the vehicle.
Take the top hat off the AE82 shock and attach this to the newly aquired AE92/3 shocks.
Reinstall this into the car.
Get the AE92/3 stub axle (Cast Bit) and grind off about 5mm either side of the metal shank on the rear most lower control arm mounting bush. (to be honest this is dodgy but will work, i chose to install new Superpro bushes, this was another drama i wont go into here......)
Bolt the AE92/3 stub axle to the shock, rear control arm and front swingarm (they all line up perfectly!!)
Now the front control arm lines up, but wont quite make the hole location on the stub axle, as the AE92/3 casting is slightly different to the AE82 one.
You could possibly get the AE92/3 front most lower control arm and try to see if it fits (I didnt have access to this, but i assume it will fit, provided the AE92/3 has the swaybar mounting points on this control arm, or do what i did and modify the original AE82 one.)
You basically need to remove about 10mm of metal from the top section of the C-Channel, to allow it to clear the casting when the suspension is at full droop ie, on axle stands.
This can be done simply with an angle grinder (i will show some pictures soon)
Next, get the donor bearing carrier (AE101) and remove they ABS pick-up wheel by placing it in a vice, wrapping the underside with a tightly wound rag and drilling a 10mm hole directly into the centre of the wheel to the depth of about 5~6mm
Once drilled, tap the wheel gently with a hammer, being careful not to spill any swarf into the bearing. The wheel should just fall off, then remove the rag gently. Check to see that no metal filings have gone into the bearing.
Take the AE101 backing plate and AE101 bearing carrier and bolt it to the stub axle (Cast bit)
Slip the AE101 disc onto the hub, then bolt up the AE101 caliper and check everything clears as it should.
Remove the caliper and attach the AE82 handbrake cables to the AE101 caliper. (The original AE82 Twinky ones fit perfectly and the job is a lot easier when these are not attached to the car)
Re-install the caliper to the hub.
Attach the original AE82 brake line to the AE101 caliper (bolts up perfect, i actually think its the same part anyway)
Bleed the brakes.
Re-mount wheels and check that the tyres dont foul on the new struts, remembering that the AE92/3 strut is actually 49mm in diametre and are bigger than the AE82 original. (my 195 50 R15 tyres have about 2~3mm clearance)
Dump it on the ground and then take it for a drive.
You will notice if you have done the Superstrut conversion to the front that there is no longer a tendancy for the rear to want to lock-up under hard braking, and the whole experience is a lot more "Complimentary" acting more like a good factory setup.
Then,enjoy all your hard work with a nice cold beverage (alcoholic of course).
Hope this helps someone out.
Cheers.

[ogre6br]

please- newbie here- please be gentle on me.

read the guide several times

and the posts here

I have
S2 SX AE92 (6/91-94, 258mm vented rotor)
and seeing that the superstrut calipers fit the AE92 mounting holes (with the propper grinding of the caliper to suit)

does this mean I can just fit the superstrut calipers to my S2 SX AE92 (6/91-94, 258mm vented rotor) and get a brake performance upgrade??

it's a standard car ATM- but with the kids being in the car a lot I'm thinking a brake upgrade will be a good thing

so is my thinking corect or have I messed something up

thanks
later
p

[TERRA Operative]

You need to fit the modified DBA743 brake rotor as outlined in the OP too, machined down to 262mm diameter and redrilled to 4 stud pattern.

Oh, and run 15" rims minimum.

[GeeEss]

Hi there,

The Standard Superstrut Rotor is 28-30mm wide (or thereabouts) whilst your Rotor is 18-20 mm wide (correct me if I'm wrong). If you try and fit Superstrut Calipers to your AE92 without changing rotors you will have another 5mm gap between pad & disk; meaning 5mm less grip on pads by caliper, leaving the real danger your calipers will drop right through gap when they start wearing leaving you without brakes - not something you want, especially with kids in the car.

I strongly recommend getting Superstrut Rotors as they are proper fitment for the calipers. You will however, need to machine them down from the standard 275mm DIA down to 262 mm to fit AE92 setup. Any brake place will do this for about $25/rotor. (ask Peps Autoparts for an AE111 BZ-R rotor* (don't know part number)). If you have difficulty you might try MacJap Motors. The proprietor Greg Macintosh, is an importer of the AE111 Levin / Trueno Corollas. The DBA 743 is, in any case officially NLA (no longer available).

Even doing this, it's not a straight up bolt on, as you will find that the inside face of the Rotor rubs against the caliper yolk. By memory it is 2.5mm out of centre so you need to move the caliper yolk in by the amount to properly centre the rotor. Removing 2.5mm off either cast aluminium caliper yolk (especially) OR cast iron steering knuckle seemed a bit risky WRT compromising strength of the component so I played it safe and got a local engineering shop to machine 1.25mm each off the adjacent faces of the caliper yolk and steering knuckle. Total cost was $50 / side to do this.

You will also have to get a machine shop to make up a shim to slide between the rotor and hub. The AE111 / Superstrut rotor has a 55mm centre hole while the AE92 hub has a 54mm DIA flange. 1mm is all it takes to set up high speed vibration of the rotor, which you dont want, hence the need for a shim. Cost was $25/side.

You will also find that because the Superstrut Calipers have the brake line union half way up (its near top of caliper on AE92) your brake lines will NOT be a safe bolt on fit - try and hook them up, then turn wheels full lock left / right and you'll see what I mean - the hoses get stetched damn tight which is not safe. I got custom hoses made up by Mark at Motohose. I was taking car to the track the next day so wasn't taking any chances. He's a very nice guy. Price - expect $70-75/side.

So you see there's a bit more involved in this than just bolting them on but its worth it in the end. Standard AE92 Brakes aren't confidence inspiring and these mods make a big difference. Best of luck with it all.


Regards

GeeEss.

ogre6br, on Dec 5 2008, 02:36 PM, said:

please- newbie here- please be gentle on me.

read the guide several times

and the posts here

I have
S2 SX AE92 (6/91-94, 258mm vented rotor)
and seeing that the superstrut calipers fit the AE92 mounting holes (with the propper grinding of the caliper to suit)

does this mean I can just fit the superstrut calipers to my S2 SX AE92 (6/91-94, 258mm vented rotor) and get a brake performance upgrade??

it's a standard car ATM- but with the kids being in the car a lot I'm thinking a brake upgrade will be a good thing

so is my thinking corect or have I messed something up

thanks

later
p

[Shano2]

GeeEss, on Dec 6 2008, 02:10 PM, said:

The Standard Superstrut Rotor is 28-30mm wide (or thereabouts) whilst your Rotor is 18-20 mm wide (correct me if I'm wrong).

OK, I will - 258mm SX rotors are 22mm std and the superstrut rotors are 25mm std.

Quote

If you try and fit Superstrut Calipers to your AE92 without changing rotors you will have another 5mm gap between pad & disk; meaning 5mm less grip on pads by caliper, leaving the real danger your calipers will drop right through gap when they start wearing leaving you without brakes - not something you want, especially with kids in the car.

Clearly you haven't done much work on these brakes?

Nothing is going to fall out. Given all your figures above are wrong the real difference is 3mm - not enough for the pistons to fall out of the calipers when the pads are worn.

The REAL issue that you have overlooked is that the pads will overhang the outer edge of the rotor.

Quote

I strongly recommend getting Superstrut Rotors as they are proper fitment for the calipers. You will however, need to machine them down from the standard 275mm DIA down to 262 mm to fit AE92 setup. Any brake place will do this for about $25/rotor. (ask Peps Autoparts for an AE111 BZ-R rotor* (don't know part number)). If you have difficulty you might try MacJap Motors. The proprietor Greg Macintosh, is an importer of the AE111 Levin / Trueno Corollas. The DBA 743 is, in any case officially NLA (no longer available).

Errr no!!!

a.) From memory the AE111 rotors are slightly thinner than the AE101 rotors and they also reintroduce the issue of the 54mm centre hole.

b.) You're incorrect about the 743 rotors. They ARE still available - I sold a set through work the other day and I now have another set back on the shelf. 743 is by far the best choice.

Quote

Even doing this, it's not a straight up bolt on, as you will find that the inside face of the Rotor rubs against the caliper yolk. By memory it is 2.5mm out of centre so you need to move the caliper yolk in by the amount to properly centre the rotor. Removing 2.5mm off either cast aluminium caliper yolk (especially) OR cast iron steering knuckle seemed a bit risky WRT compromising strength of the component so I played it safe and got a local engineering shop to machine 1.25mm each off the adjacent faces of the caliper yolk and steering knuckle. Total cost was $50 / side to do this.

WTF is a caliper "yolk"?

You have seriously fvcked something up. I have done plenty (15 or so) of these conversions and never had any clearance issues other than the outer edge of the disc rubbing on the inside edge of the caliper as outlined in the first post. No steering clearence issues at all.

Quote

You will also have to get a machine shop to make up a shim to slide between the rotor and hub. The AE111 / Superstrut rotor has a 55mm centre hole while the AE92 hub has a 54mm DIA flange. 1mm is all it takes to set up high speed vibration of the rotor, which you dont want, hence the need for a shim. Cost was $25/side.

Not if you use the correct rotors. 743

Quote

You will also find that because the Superstrut Calipers have the brake line union half way up (its near top of caliper on AE92) your brake lines will NOT be a safe bolt on fit - try and hook them up, then turn wheels full lock left / right and you'll see what I mean - the hoses get stetched damn tight which is not safe. I got custom hoses made up by Mark at Motohose. I was taking car to the track the next day so wasn't taking any chances. He's a very nice guy. Price - expect $70-75/side.

Hmmm I also don't recall having a problem with the brake hoses either. On my own car I used WRX braided lines (Goodridge).

Quote

So you see there's a bit more involved in this than just bolting them on but its worth it in the end.

You've just complicated the living p1ss out of this conversion and wasted a lot of money it would seam. It's not hard - just get the correct parts, starting with the rotors.

[ogre6br]

it's the shims to pad things out to 55 mm that leaves me cold- not something I'm going to risk my kids on.

did some measureing today
and some searching on here

also downloaded the DBA cattle-dog

going by the DBA and my measurements seems I have the
AE 90, 92, 93 D.O.H.C. 8/89 - 6/91 F 704 Vented 238 18 54 4

Looks like there is an upgrade available sticking with 54mm center hole

AE 93 DOHC 6/91 -10/94 F 708 Vented 258 22 54 4

This disk seems to be close to the 260 dimension that you guys say the 743 rotors need to be machined down to

If I use the 708 rotor- as I read it eliminating the center hole size issue-- whats the best caliper I can use??

or have Igot his arsed about as well


I am not going to do the shim or 55mm center hole discs-- whats my best option going with the 54mm hole option?

thanks
later
P

[92_GZE]

ST185 4wd celica front disc machined down to 260mm OD and redrilled to 4x100.

http://www.bpa.com.au/REL_Toyota.pdf

That's exactly what I have on my daily driven AE92 and it's been perfect for the past 40,000km.

This post has been edited by 92_GZE: 06 December 2008 - 06:21 PM

[GeeEss]

Shano2, on Dec 6 2008, 06:43 PM, said:

OK, I will - 258mm SX rotors are 22mm std and the superstrut rotors are 25mm std.

I have a digital vernier caliper and reasonable eyesight, AND cross referenced the rotors I sourced from an AE111 importer with actual rotors on my brothers AE111 BZR; they are both 28mm thick, if this is not OEM thickness then so be it, but that's what they are, period. . .

Clearly you haven't done much work on these brakes?

Maybe not, but I've raced on them 3 times without issue. I DID go to my local brake outlet (Weldon Brake & Clutch) who called DBA while I was there and was told directly that these rotors were NLA - I can only go on the information I'm given. .

Nothing is going to fall out. Given all your figures above are wrong the real difference is 3mm - not enough for the pistons to fall out of the calipers when the pads are worn.

The REAL issue that you have overlooked is that the pads will overhang the outer edge of the rotor.

I did not overlook that issue - if I had I simply would have got DBA Rotor #708. . . OR 743


Errr no!!!

a.) From memory the AE111 rotors are slightly thinner than the AE101 rotors and they also reintroduce the issue of the 54mm centre hole.

Not according to DBA catalog AE101 rotors ( # 711) specs are: 20-22mm thick.

b.) You're incorrect about the 743 rotors. They ARE still available - I sold a set through work the other day and I now have another set back on the shelf. 743 is by far the best choice.

As I said above, that's what I was informed by local Brake outlet. . .

Referring to DBA catalog, specs for 743 rotor are as follows; 255 dia / 46 hgt / 20-22 thk / 54mm ctr / 5 holes.

This is 6mm less than measurement of actual AE111 rotors I had to hand. If this was only issue, I would have gone with 743 rotor and saved myself the admitted hassle of shaving the caliper yolk (= frame caliper hinges off) and knuckle. The reason I did not use DBA 743 was due to listed DIA of 255mm, and the issue of pad overhang.

You refer to this rotor and the need to machine it down to 262mm so it doesn't foul Superstrut caliper but its listed diameter is 7mm less than that - please explain?

WTF is a caliper "yolk"? See above. . .

You have seriously fvcked something up. I have done plenty (15 or so) of these conversions and never had any clearance issues other than the outer edge of the disc rubbing on the inside edge of the caliper as outlined in the first post. No steering clearence issues at all.


Not if you use the correct rotors. 743


Hmmm I also don't recall having a problem with the brake hoses either. On my own car I used WRX braided lines (Goodridge).

Yeah well that wasn't mentioned in the brake guide. . . looking at it from a newbies point of view standard AE92 hoses (even if you assume they're long enough) don't really work as the straight hose unions result in the hoses touching the steering knuckle as they turn thru 180deg to swing back behind the strut. This is not necessarily unsafe but I just unsatisfactory in my opinion so i got hoses made up with 45deg bend union which runs hoses up vertically resulting in less bending around strut; yes I spent a few bucks more getting a neater solution - is that so bad???

You've just complicated the living p1ss out of this conversion and wasted a lot of money it would seam. It's not hard - just get the correct parts, starting with the rotors.

Maybe, but I would not have used AE111 rotors if;

1. DBA catalog had specced 743 rotors with DIA greater than your recommended 262mm, ( a fact queried by sales guy at Weldon's as well) AND
2. If Weldon's Brake had confirmed availability of these rotors.

If the f__k-up was anyone's, it was theirs, not that it changes anything. . . . .


PS: to other guy, I'm a pretty careful guy, and would not have used spacer shims if they weren't safe. They are stepped and fit behind chamfewr on reverse side of rotor - there's no chance in hell of them coming out. . .


GeeEss

[jmaro]

I got quoted here in perth $230 ea. for DBA743 slotted rotors, they are 178mm * 25mm but they can't machine them down so I will need to ring around for a company that can.

This post has been edited by jmaro: 08 December 2008 - 12:22 PM

[Shano2]

GeeEss, on Dec 7 2008, 08:33 PM, said:

I have a digital vernier caliper and reasonable eyesight, AND cross referenced the rotors I sourced from an AE111 importer with actual rotors on my brothers AE111 BZR; they are both 28mm thick, if this is not OEM thickness then so be it, but that's what they are, period. . .

You really should get you eyes tested then coz

a.) Nowhere in the original topic was there mention of swapping to AE111 superstrut brakes. The whole article was geared towards AE101 superstrut brakes. I suggest you re-read it. You have confused the whole conversion by throwing AE111 into the mix.

b.) The AE111 rotors were, in fact, 24mm not 28mm. I have no idea what you have but based on all the info / experience I have they are not AE111 superstrut rotors and are perhaps the reason you have had so much difficulty

GeeEss, on Dec 7 2008, 08:33 PM, said:

I did not overlook that issue - if I had I simply would have got DBA Rotor #708

Why the fvck would you do that???

- 1st you made the assertion that things are gunna start falling apart by using rotors that are too thin.

- I corrected this (not trying to blow my own trumpet but I know this not to be correct) suggesting the important issue is not the thickness of the rotor but rather the diameter so that the pads don't overhang the rotor. Through trial and error I have clearly established that 259mm is the ABSOLUTE minimum diameter rotor for this conversion

- You then make an argument for a smaller rotor??? Can I please have a bucket of what you are on?

GeeEss, on Dec 7 2008, 08:33 PM, said:

. . . OR 743

Your best suggestion so far.

GeeEss, on Dec 7 2008, 08:33 PM, said:

Not according to DBA catalog AE101 rotors ( # 711) specs are: 20-22mm thick.

No mention has ever been made of DBA711 rotors anywhere in this whole thread why confuse that matter further? Oh I see why.....

OK clearly I made the mistake of assuming that by reference to "AE101" rotors that a reasonably intelligent combatant would understand that I was of course referring to the AE101 SUPERSTRUT rotors since we are, afterall, debating the fitment of superstrut brakes. Clearly this assumption on my part was flawed.

GeeEss, on Dec 7 2008, 08:33 PM, said:

As I said above, that's what I was informed by local Brake outlet. . .

You local brake outlet was wrong!!!

I was bored at work today so I did a little calling around my suppliers and found the following prices (what I would sell these rotors for, RETAIL, based on my cost direct from each of these suppliers)...

PBR - Plenty in stock. Distributed nationally ex Melbourne. Retail $140 each
DBA - Plenty in stock. Distrbuted nationally. Distributed by branches in all eastern states + WA. Retail $230 each
PROTEX (ATAP) - Plenty in stock. Distributed nationally through branches in most states. Retail $125 each
RDA - Plenty in stock - Distributed Nationally through branches in most states. Retail $140 each
RELIANCE (BPA) - Plenty in stock. Distributed nationally. Retail $130

PERSONALLY I would use these rotors on my own car in the following order

DBA
PBR / RDA
PROTEX
RELIANCE

GeeEss, on Dec 7 2008, 08:33 PM, said:

Referring to DBA catalog, specs for 743 rotor are as follows; 255 dia / 46 hgt / 20-22 thk / 54mm ctr / 5 holes.

This is 6mm less than measurement of actual AE111 rotors I had to hand. If this was only issue, I would have gone with 743 rotor and saved myself the admitted hassle of shaving the caliper yolk (= frame caliper hinges off) and knuckle. The reason I did not use DBA 743 was due to listed DIA of 255mm, and the issue of pad overhang.

You refer to this rotor and the need to machine it down to 262mm so it doesn't foul Superstrut caliper but its listed diameter is 7mm less than that - please explain?

Simple really - the DBA catalouge is wrong.

The DBA743 IS 275mm dia * 25mm thick. Try here - http://www.bpa.com.au/REL_Toyota.pdf

For some reason, I assume a typing error, the specs listed in the DBA catalouge for the DBA743 have changed.

If I could be arsed (I can't be fvcked - I've already handed it all to everyone on a silver platter) I would dig out the pdf file copy I have of an older version of the DBA catalouge that clearly listed the specs as I have stated - It is what I used to research the use of these rotors in the first place. I don't care what your local brake outlet or the CURRENT DBA catalouge say they're wrong. But hey if you don't want to take my word for it, please PLEASE, order a set in and measure them for yourself to test this theory - don't worry you won't have to pay for them when you tell them they are incorrect accord to the DBA catalouge . I can't wait to see what your next post says if you have the balls to do so.

EVERY other catalouge I have at work indicates they are as per the specs I have just stated. Furthermore I know this to be the case from the 15 or so sets I have bought over the years AND the set I physically measured today!!!

If I could be fvcked I would call DBA to inform them of their error, but I can't.

I no longer own / drive a Corolla and only bother offering up help / advice in this topic because I started it and still get emails / pms asking me questions. If everyone prefers I am quite happy to delete every post (all 8 million odd of them), including the entire brake article and 6 speed conversion article, I have made and not share any of the information I have nutted out for myself in an attempt to help and save people time and money.

GeeEss, on Dec 7 2008, 08:33 PM, said:

Yeah well that wasn't mentioned in the brake guide

Again, re-read the article after you have had your eyes checked........

Under the title "SUPERSTRUT BRAKES"

Quote

3.) Bit's and pieces :
- Pads for the Superstrut brakes are the same as SW20 MR2 so parts aren't a problem.
- The AE92 flexible brake lines will bolt up to the twin piston calipers.
- The minimum I've tried these brakes under is a ...............

I didn't mention the WRX braided lines because, quite frankly, I forgot about them. They're of little relevance anyway as they're not NECESSARY. They were just a personal choice.

GeeEss, on Dec 7 2008, 08:33 PM, said:

looking at it from a newbies point of view standard AE92 hoses (even if you assume they're long enough) don't really work as the straight hose unions result in the hoses touching the steering knuckle as they turn thru 180deg to swing back behind the strut. This is not necessarily unsafe but I just unsatisfactory in my opinion so i got hoses made up with 45deg bend union which runs hoses up vertically resulting in less bending around strut; yes I spent a few bucks more getting a neater solution - is that so bad???

Nothing wring with you making your brakes look pretty if you wish. I suggest though that whatever brakes it is you have that they are not Superstrut brakes and are perhaps the reason you have had to carry out SO MANY modifications that NO-ONE else has had to do. With all due respect and with this in mind I would suggest that your experience be ignored by all and the simplest plan is to stick with the, much easier to source and fit, AE101 superstrut brake package.

GeeEss, on Dec 7 2008, 08:33 PM, said:

Maybe, but I would not have used AE111 rotors if;

1. DBA catalog had specced 743 rotors with DIA greater than your recommended 262mm, ( a fact queried by sales guy at Weldon's as well) AND
2. If Weldon's Brake had confirmed availability of these rotors.

If the f__k-up was anyone's, it was theirs, not that it changes anything. . . . .

Perhaps you might wish to call the guy at Weldons and inform him he was incorrect on both counts. Up to you really.

Otherwise this has all been covered above.

[Shano2]

jmaro, on Dec 8 2008, 12:21 PM, said:

I got quoted here in perth $230 ea. for DBA743 slotted rotors, they are 178mm * 25mm but they can't machine them down so I will need to ring around for a company that can.

I assume "178" was also a typo?

See above

If worst comes to worst contact Kevin Gavin @ "Specialised Brake and clutch" in Penrith NSW. He will supply, machine and post the rotors to you.

[damo101]

Shano2, on Dec 15 2008, 11:52 PM, said:

You really should get you eyes tested then coz

a.) Nowhere in the original topic was there mention of swapping to AE111 superstrut brakes. The whole article was geared towards AE101 superstrut brakes. I suggest you re-read it. You have confused the whole conversion by throwing AE111 into the mix.

b.) The AE111 rotors were, in fact, 24mm not 28mm. I have no idea what you have but based on all the info / experience I have they are not AE111 superstrut rotors and are perhaps the reason you have had so much difficulty




Why the fvck would you do that???

- 1st you made the assertion that things are gunna start falling apart by using rotors that are too thin.

- I corrected this (not trying to blow my own trumpet but I know this not to be correct) suggesting the important issue is not the thickness of the rotor but rather the diameter so that the pads don't overhang the rotor. Through trial and error I have clearly established that 259mm is the ABSOLUTE minimum diameter rotor for this conversion

- You then make an argument for a smaller rotor??? Can I please have a bucket of what you are on?




Your best suggestion so far.




No mention has ever been made of DBA711 rotors anywhere in this whole thread why confuse that matter further? Oh I see why.....

OK clearly I made the mistake of assuming that by reference to "AE101" rotors that a reasonably intelligent combatant would understand that I was of course referring to the AE101 SUPERSTRUT rotors since we are, afterall, debating the fitment of superstrut brakes. Clearly this assumption on my part was flawed.




You local brake outlet was wrong!!!

I was bored at work today so I did a little calling around my suppliers and found the following prices (what I would sell these rotors for, RETAIL, based on my cost direct from each of these suppliers)...

PBR - Plenty in stock. Distributed nationally ex Melbourne. Retail $140 each
DBA - Plenty in stock. Distrbuted nationally. Distributed by branches in all eastern states + WA. Retail $230 each
PROTEX (ATAP) - Plenty in stock. Distributed nationally through branches in most states. Retail $125 each
RDA - Plenty in stock - Distributed Nationally through branches in most states. Retail $140 each
RELIANCE (BPA) - Plenty in stock. Distributed nationally. Retail $130

PERSONALLY I would use these rotors on my own car in the following order

DBA
PBR / RDA
PROTEX
RELIANCE




Simple really - the DBA catalouge is wrong.

The DBA743 IS 275mm dia * 25mm thick. Try here - http://www.bpa.com.au/REL_Toyota.pdf

For some reason, I assume a typing error, the specs listed in the DBA catalouge for the DBA743 have changed.

If I could be arsed (I can't be fvcked - I've already handed it all to everyone on a silver platter) I would dig out the pdf file copy I have of an older version of the DBA catalouge that clearly listed the specs as I have stated - It is what I used to research the use of these rotors in the first place. I don't care what your local brake outlet or the CURRENT DBA catalouge say they're wrong. But hey if you don't want to take my word for it, please PLEASE, order a set in and measure them for yourself to test this theory - don't worry you won't have to pay for them when you tell them they are incorrect accord to the DBA catalouge . I can't wait to see what your next post says if you have the balls to do so.

EVERY other catalouge I have at work indicates they are as per the specs I have just stated. Furthermore I know this to be the case from the 15 or so sets I have bought over the years AND the set I physically measured today!!!

If I could be fvcked I would call DBA to inform them of their error, but I can't.

I no longer own / drive a Corolla and only bother offering up help / advice in this topic because I started it and still get emails / pms asking me questions. If everyone prefers I am quite happy to delete every post (all 8 million odd of them), including the entire brake article and 6 speed conversion article, I have made and not share any of the information I have nutted out for myself in an attempt to help and save people time and money.




Again, re-read the article after you have had your eyes checked........

Under the title "SUPERSTRUT BRAKES"



I didn't mention the WRX braided lines because, quite frankly, I forgot about them. They're of little relevance anyway as they're not NECESSARY. They were just a personal choice.





Nothing wring with you making your brakes look pretty if you wish. I suggest though that whatever brakes it is you have that they are not Superstrut brakes and are perhaps the reason you have had to carry out SO MANY modifications that NO-ONE else has had to do. With all due respect and with this in mind I would suggest that your experience be ignored by all and the simplest plan is to stick with the, much easier to source and fit, AE101 superstrut brake package.





Perhaps you might wish to call the guy at Weldons and inform him he was incorrect on both counts. Up to you really.

Otherwise this has all been covered above.

please dont..i always use both of those guides for research and references.im sure ALOT of other people would to.

[jmaro]

Shano2, on Dec 15 2008, 11:56 PM, said:

I assume "178" was also a typo?

See above

If worst comes to worst contact Kevin Gavin @ "Specialised Brake and clutch" in Penrith NSW. He will supply, machine and post the rotors to you.

that's what I was told, rang up again today to confirm. 278mm * 25mm, 54mm centre, 5 stud pattern off the ST185 celica. $230 retail which is exactly what you found, but trade price $135 inc. But I believe you when you say it's 275mm.

[TERRA Operative]

So wait. WRX brake lines are a direct fit onto the superstrut brakes????


Please say yes! It would solve a significant problem for me if you say yes.

[92_GZE]

I have goodrich WRX braided lines bolted up to the superstrut calipers in my AE92. Used to have the stock AE92 lines connected before I upgraded.

[Shano2]

TERRA Operative, on Dec 16 2008, 04:21 PM, said:

So wait. WRX brake lines are a direct fit onto the superstrut brakes????


Please say yes! It would solve a significant problem for me if you say yes.

Yes. Definately. Off the top of my head MY99 on WRX with 4 pot calipers are the lines you want.

Only difference is the std AE92 lines are located in the caliper by either a small locating pin that hangs off the end of the line where it bolts to the caliper which goes down into a small hole in the caliper or two tags either side of the line to locate it (I forget which now). The WRX line has neither. This makes ZERO difference as once it's bolted down it is the banjo bolt that locks the line in place and I have NEVER had a banjo bolt come loose as long as you replce the copper washers either side of the banjo bolt every time you undo it (total cost = less than $1)

[TERRA Operative]

Freaking Aye, free love for everyone.

I'm off to sort some braided brake lines!

[Mystik]

damo101, on Dec 15 2008, 11:36 PM, said:

please dont..i always use both of those guides for research and references.im sure ALOT of other people would to.

same

i have used the brake guide when i did the rear brakes on my cs hatch(drums to disc)

and i will be using it again when i get around to doing the doing the ae101 rear brakes onto my sx in the near future.

plus i also quote from this topic when it come to others asking bout brake upgrades and i also have directed said people to the thread as well so they can have a read

[200Boy]

We love you shano! dont punish the many for the actions of the few

[lolgti]

Hey Shano, any chance of posting up the pics again?

[ogre6br]

200Boy, on Dec 18 2008, 12:46 AM, said:

We love you shano! dont punish the many for the actions of the few

mea culpa

mea culpa

mea maxima culpa

P