[Talasas]

This is a visual addition to the thread which may or may not still exist on how to identify your 4A-GE. Either way, lately I've been seeing that people are still having trouble identifying their engines, namely those that are from Japanese models.



So here they are as you would find them from factory...

UPDATE: 20 Valve engines added. Supercharged engines still to be done.

[ae93_sx]

I think some late ae82's had the second cam covers that you listed but were still only 86kw (bigport) version. my import 87 model ae92 had the same cam covers (second one listed) but going from the year, i was lead to beleive that is was only the 86kw version.

If it is non-tvis and has the plate that covers the spark plug leads it is 100kw. if it is tvis and fwd intake with the cover that has holes in it for the spark plug leads then it is 86kw. if it is tvis and rwd intake with the cover that has holes in it for the spark plug leads then it is 96kw. Might be flawed though.

[DVS]

be carefull of swapped over covers

[Trev084]

Series 1 & 2 were classed as the 86kW version but they all varied from 86kW up to around 95kW

[Riley]

i wish my cam covers where that clean

[rthy]

JP, on Apr 18 2006, 06:50 PM, said:

http://www.twincam.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=6640

so all redtop bigports are 7rib? or only the jdm/euro version?

[Trev084]

1st series is 3 rib (bigport)
2nd series is 7 rib (bigport)
3rd series is 7 rib (smallport)

[Talasas]

If your car is a late 87 model then it would in fact be classed as a 7-rib Gen 2 (production started late 87). This should mean that is is the 95 kW engine. I'll make changes to this as things develop, I thought I'd just do a clean graphic rather than just have photos of dirty old engines.

Also I wrote "96 kW" going by the 95.5 kW rating I found of the Gen 2 engine. Can anyone clarify this? I'd like correct power and torque figures for a change as even Phil Bradshaw's page has it wrong.

Also, this is a generic cover in that the most powerful of each classes is taken into account, so the 4A-GELU and the like wihch may have less power due to emission controls aren't taken into account.

[ae93_sx]

I thought the very first 4ages that were rwd in the sprinters were the 95kw ones. and the 86kw ones were the second generation. can't remember where i read that now. i might have had a 95kw 4age in my fxgt all along!

[Hiro Protagonist]

Isn't the 95kw version just due to the JDM tuning of the ECU for running on 98 octane?

[Trev084]

Hiro Protagonist, on Apr 18 2006, 08:06 PM, said:

Isn't the 95kw version just due to the JDM tuning of the ECU for running on 98 octane?

Yes hence the reason they are still classed as 86kW engines.

[eviltwin]

so with a JDM ECU running a 86kw bigport would give a 10kw gain? is this true?

[Talasas]

Okay I see this is going to turn into a debate. Please, if anyone has any real concrete FACTS about the engine please elaborate them here. Leave the other questions for another thread.

I'd like to hear JP explain this in better detail. Obviously people are STILL not agreeing on what the JDM 4A-GEs had.

ae93_sx: you saw that on Phil Bradshaw's page. He claims to have gotten the info from a Jap Levin/Trueno tuning magazine but I'm not sure if he copied it down correctly. Simply because no manufacturer can justify making a newer engine LESS powerful than previous versions without good cause (i.e complete new design etc.).

So let's break this down (ADM/JDM only):

AE82:
3-rib TVIS (Aus - TwinCam, JDM - FX-GT & other)

AE86:
3-rib TVIS RWD (JDM - Levin/Trueno)

AA63:
3-rib TVIS RWD (JDM - Celica/Carina)

AW11:
3-rib TVIS (JDM - MR2 G-Limited)

AE92:
7-rib TVIS (JDM - FX-GT, Levin, Trueno and other)
7-rib SP (Aus - SX, GTi, JDM - Later spec FX-GT, & Other)

We can argue about the post-E9 engines later...

[feral4mr2]

^^ dont forget to add the oz delivered aw11 (normaly 1987+) 7 rib bigport 'red and black' 4age that has the same internals as the bigport 4agze bar the pistons.

the break down of engines at the bottom of this page is 'prity' close to correct, sure there are still some mistooks as all the other internet sites with 4age/gze specs have.
http://www.users.bigpond.com/vidore/toyota_4age_engine.htm

[ae93_sx]

I think some of the later aus spec ae82 twincams had a 7 rib big port motor. At least one 88 model and one 89 model that i know of both have 7 rib blocks.

[Talasas]

Thanks Jason. So it is indeed true that the AE92 Series 1 4A-GE is less powerful than the earlier 3-rib versions? That's very, very interesting. Now it leads me to ask why.

AE86 GT-Apex, GTV, GT Levin's and Trueno's 4A-GEU
Power: 95.6 @6600rpm
Torque: 147.1 Nm @5200rpm

AE82 FX-GT 4A-GELU
Power: 95.6 @6600rpm
Torque: 147.1 Nm @5200rpm

AE92 FX-GT, FX-GTV 4A-GE
Power: 103.0 kW @ 7200rpm
Torque: 147.1 Nm @ 6000rpm

AE92 GT-Apex, GTV, GT Levin's and Trueno's 4A-GE
Series I
Power: 88.3 kW @ 6600rpm
Torque: 142.2 Nm @ 5200rpm

Series II
Power: 103.0 kW @ 7200rpm
Torque: 147.1 Nm @ 6000rpm

[Trev084]

Here are all the 16 valve 4AGE specs.

P.S. The bore and stroke are done in mm's or inches.

This post has been edited by Trev084: 19 April 2006 - 08:34 PM

[Talasas]

I wouldn't believe anything I read in those car magazines, they have been notorious for being wrong. If I can find the article which I once read they got their engines mixed up (read 4A-GE in photo) and claimed it output 200 hp from factory...

[SXseca]

um im a bit confused..
i looked at a car today..it was an AE82 seca that the owner claimed had a 100Kw motor in it.
i looked at it and it DIDN'T have T-VIS on the intake manifold but DID have ONLY RED writing on the cam covers.(sugesting 100Kw) BUT the leads for the spark plugs went throught the "valley cover" is it?? they didnt go in at the one side and go under it..(suggesting 86Kw)

how is this posible? could he have just put the 100Kw intake manifold on the 86Kw engine or could he have got the 100Kw smallport engine and put the bigport cam covers on it??
sorry for the long post but it got me confused??

cheers
nathan

[Tazz]

JP i'm curious about the the differences about the 2 generations of the silvertop 20v. I have noticed the differences in the throttle linkage and believe that witzl told me that the singular one was the latter of the two.

In the other thread you stated that the latter ae101 motor has better midrange and was quicker that the previous.

I'm just curious as to why this is? this is the first talk i've seen comparing the two and stating that one was better than the other.

[squirt01]

ok,
i have, i think a third gen, it has the ribbed manifold
gen three cam cover with hidden leads but the dizzy
cap is not facing upwards ?????
would it be the 96kw version (b/port)

[Talasas]

Just thought I'd let everyone know I've updated the first post...

[Seasalt]

To back up the other posts on this point: I've just purchased a 1988 AE82 Seca Twincam. It has the red and black top seven rib TVIS, and it is the original engine as the number matches the original 1988 "Toyota Retail Delivery Card" in the papers the previous owner gave me.

So in Australia you could get a post June 87 AE82 with a 7 rib TVIS.

[Anaru]

i think i have the second gen silver top, how can i tell? i think i do because of the rev characteristics

[PsyCo]

This should be sticky'd in E&G or FAQ section.

[GTi_RSi]

Anaru, on Sep 22 2007, 03:40 PM, said:

i think i have the second gen silver top, how can i tell? i think i do because of the rev characteristics

does it have 2 throttle linkages or 1?

[Anaru]

two!




im guessing its a series 2 silver top?


would this explain why i rate the silver top more than you guys ?

[GTi_RSi]

nope its actually a series 1, the singular throttle linkage is the later of the 2 gens, and the later versions had better alignment on the inlet manifold and was somewhat revised outputing a little higher on the factory claims with better mid range performance.

sorry to burst your bubble mate

[Anaru]

o well, i've always been suspicious of my motor since it did come out of an FXGTAE101

[JDM-20V]

hey guys sorry if this is a repost.. jus wondering whats the difference between a "big port" and a "small port".?
wat would a 20v silvertop be.? big or small?


cheers